ABSOLUTELY! The definition of Eagle Syndrome is elongated styloid processes OR calcified stylohyoid ligaments OR a combination of the two.
The stylohyoid ligaments run from the lesser horns (cornus) of the hyoid bone to the tips of the styloid processes. They play a very minor role in helping w/ swallowing.
I had both - elongated styloids & partially calcified ligaments.
Wow, that’s fascinating! 
Would Dr. Samji be able to see calcified S-H ligaments on my CT scan?
Yes. They’re obvious if they’re calcified. If you had a CT scan w/o contranst, the ligaments aren’t visible if there is no calcification on them.
Glad that you have an answer for your symptoms, not wishing ES on you though! But good that you can now see Dr Samji & start thinking about treatment! Try not to worry while you wait, easier said than done I know, but lots of members have had some compression of blood vessels, it makes the decision to have surgery easier!
Hello All,
I’ve been reading A LOT of topics and honestly I’m getting a little discouraged by how many times I’ve seen people say they were not relived from all their symptoms and surgery brought on more like first bite, Meniere’s, numb lips, & tongue and the list goes on!
Now, I’m getting kinda worried that surgery may not help and comes with a lot of risks and/or complications. My most problematic symptom has always been Eustachian tube dysfunction where I have popping, fullness, and trouble equalizing pressure. Second to that is severe head pressure, and last is the general face pain with popping at TMJ joint. It’s hard to predict which order they present themselves each day as it moves around like playing chess. And, ever since I had my two upper wisdom teeth extracted I feel wobbly, tipsy, lightheaded, and winded from just going up a short flight of stairs. The best way to describe it is like having 1 two many glasses of wine. In addition, both my ears are having problems now since oral surgery.
I read one post where a person with eustachian tube dysfunction was told by Dr. Samji that he wasn’t sure ES could be a cause for ETD. This person went through with the surgery and it didn’t help one bit and he feels it was a waste as it did nothing.
So, yeah that’s pretty discouraging 
So, I’m sure you can sense my concerns and I feel like I’m a lost cause again! 
And I’m certainly not confident that having surgery will make my ETD better as there are no known studies that ES caused it in the first place. In fact, I saw 1 website that said ETD causes ES. So, it’s like which came first the chicken or the egg?
Sorry for rambling on but my mind is on wheels right now thinking about all this🤪
From personal experience I can only say that having surgery has been life changing for me! Yes, there are risks, & not every symptom has gone, but I was starting to feel really ill with vascular symptoms before surgery, & now both sides are gone the improvement is huge! I sympathise with the feeling a bit drunk; I felt like that all the time, & the head pressure was nearly unbearable at times! All gone now! Dizzy spells, not being able to sleep at night because of pressure on my neck (whichever side I slept on it was painful & increased the vascular symptoms, so did lying on my back, so I ended up in a reclining chair every night), I had similar tooth pain as you, which was worsening as was some facial numbness; that’s improved too.
I think if you have vascular symptoms having surgery is an easier decision, I didn’t want those spikes keep compressing my jugular veins any longer! I had no vascular symptoms for a while, & put off having surgery for a bit, as I felt the pain I was in didn’t justify the risks, but the vascular symptoms definitely changed that for me.
Yes, who knows if surgery will help all the symptoms you have, and there are risks, but if you know you have ES & it’s likely causing the head pressure etc. that you have then that’ s not going to go away… And some of the symptoms you mention post surgery improve with time, like facial numbness. I don’t know that Meniers disease for example is a result of surgery for ES? And with an experienced surgeon risks can be minimised.
But it is a personal decision for everyone, and not always an easy one!
@Christy I also have the ear popping and pain, in addition to dizziness and difficulty with physical activity (and a long list of other symptoms). I have bilaterally elongated styloids and no ligament calcification that is visible by CT. I used the 3D instructions posted by Snappleof Discord and I believe this helped me and a number of my doctors, although I can say that Dr. Samji will not accept the 3D images. I had my radiologist go back and measure the styloids months later for Dr. Samji. The surgeon imaging center should do this for you. I am scheduled to have the first styloid removed in a week by Dr. Samji. I’ll post my results/progress:) Most people who have successful surgeries move on with life and don’t provide updates but I will definitely make an effort to do this! Seems most people who have successful surgery don’t post updates since they are able to completely put ES behind them and focus on their things, but that leaves us with a bunch of reports by others who are still having issues and it makes the success rate seem artificially small. My hope is that at least some of the most troubling of my symptoms are taken away with surgery. It could be that I am left with some that I thought were related but weren’t. It may be that I’ll need both sides removed before I can get maximum relief. Only time will tell…but I’ll make sure to keep the forum up to date in the coming weeks 
Best of luck to you in your journey to recovery!
Hi Christy - the feelings/hesitations you are experiencing are completely normal and valid. It means you take your life seriously - as you should. Life is a gift from God and we only get one body!
When I was worried about surgery I had to tell myself two main things:
1 - I couldn’t “unwill” this condition from happening to me. I got stuck in this weird pattern for a few weeks where I wanted to ignore it/try to forget about it. Denial is very powerful! I kept thinking if I only gave it more time it would “go away”. Anyone else do that?
2 - I wasn’t going to have the chance to do it “two ways”. We all wish we could have the surgery and see what it felt like a year post-op before we decided whether to go under the knife. Will it be worth it? Will I be ok afterwards? Will I feel better? I did not like the feeling of loss of control and uncertainty. In my case I had never had ANY surgery or even broken bone. Surgery seemed radical.
Having the surgery was one of the biggest decisions I’ve ever made in my life. But I pretty much felt like I didn’t have another option. Maybe in time you’ll get there? It’s such an individual journey for everyone.
I love that I had the surgery. And my tongue is close to 95% better now! And it’s just been over 2 months. Think about life with surgery and life without surgery and make the best decision you can. Time helps - it’s not like your scheduled for surgery next week or something. Keep reading stories on here. I’m sure redbird will post some good things. You’re processing so much right now. Tell yourself you don’t “have to” make any decisions right now. You’re not done gathering info, right? So you can’t decide yet. I said so 
My last thought is to caution you not to do something I did when I had a poor prenatal diagnosis with my fourth child. I was 20 weeks pregnant and searching the internet for hours and hours with one goal in mind - I thought if I dug deep enough into the internet that I would find my daughter. I truly believed that the story of my baby would be out there on a website and it would say: this is exactly what she’ll be like, this is exactly how everything is going to go and this is what her health problems will look like. I wanted to patch together alllllll the stories about families with kids with Down syndrome and heart defects and my mind wanted to settle on a “picture” of how it was all going to look.
I can tell you that letting go and trusting was a huge spiritual challenge for me both back then and now with ES. In both cases it turned out infinitely better than my little brain thought it was going to.
Thank you all for your replies! It was exactly what I needed to hear to put my mind at rest a bit with all this! I actually made an impromptu drive to the ocean today with the family and made it a good day! I wasn’t gonna let my pain rule another one! Life is to short and I want to live it fully with what I got left!
Hi Redbird773
Wow, it sounds like you’ve been through quite a bit as well and I’m sorry to hear that! I’m glad you will be having Dr.Samji do your surgery as I continually read he’s one of the best! I’ll be praying for you and please do keep us updated on your recovery!! Wishing you all the best!!! Btw, how long did your styloids measure? I was disappointed that my radiologist did not provide measurements even though I requested twice! I tried converting my 2D scan to the 3D scan but it did not show up that clear. Perhaps it’s because it’s w/o contrast? I’m strongly considering going to a well known diagnostic radiology place in town that does 3D images and the good thing is, their familiar w/t ES. But, the bad part is it’s really expensive! They provide a complete report that I can bring to my upcoming apt. Even if Dr. Samji doesn’t want to use it, it will help me by having a second person confirm the diagnosis 
With or without contrast won’t make any difference to how clear the scan is or measuring the styloids, contrast shows the blood vessels up. Measuring styloids is interestingly inaccurate! Many members have found out after surgery that their styloids were quite a bit longer than the radiologist measured them…if it helps you come to a clear decision about surgery then that’s up to you, but if it’s going to cost quite a bit & Dr Samji is happy with the scan report you already have, I’d save that money for a blender to make smoothies after surgery, treats & some more days out with your family when you’re over this 
Hi Christy,
I’ll add my 2 cents. I have/had Meniere’s. It cropped up between my ES surgeries but was the result of a cycling accident which caused a head injury. As far as I’ve read there are 3 major causes of Meniere’s Disease - heredity, head injury or virus. ES in itself doesn’t appear to be a cause of Meniere’s. First bite syndrome is painful at first but the pain becomes much less as time passes & FBS often goes away completely. As Jules noted, numb lip/tongue problems generally resolve w/in a couple of months of ES surgery as they are the result of nerve irritation & not usually nerve damage.
So many of the symptoms you listed seem to be related to ES, & I would expect that most, if not all, will be significantly less problematic if you were to have surgery. I had the problem you talk about regarding getting winded walking up stairs or w/ minimal exertion. For me that went along w/ a blood pressure drop when I did anything that was even a bit aerobic. I also had weird heart palpitations. I determined these were caused by my styloids irritating my vagus nerve. Once they were removed, those symptoms quit. I also had some light-headedness which also resolved post op.
I’m not familiar w/ ETD thus can’t respond one way or the other about that. I will say that many people have ear troubles that come w/ ES so there is some chance you’d notice a reduction in those symptoms after surgery as well.
Glad you’ve found encouragement here.
Hi Jules,
Thank you for educating me more about the 2D and 3D images! I’m gonna save my money and just present my 2D CT scan to Dr. Samji and see what his findings are. If he can’t help me for whatever reason I’ll go back to the drawing board and get that really expensive 3D picture. I’d much rather use my money on something useful like a blender or one of those Instant Pot food makers! It would make life in the kitchen much easier! 
Did someone say Instant Pot!!! Got me through January and February! I just finished making some oatmeal in it for tomorrow morning!!! 
Yummy, I love oatmeal!!! Ok, Instant Pot here I come! 
@Christy, thank you for the prayers!! I’m starting to get some butterflies…one more day at home before leaving for CA.
My styloids both measure just under 4 cm. I’m not sure what angle they measured from so it’s possible that it’s actually longer. I guess they just recently started bothering me because they are skinny and not particularly curvy. I had many CTs and not one of the 4 radiologists commented on the styloids, despite the fact that they have grown down to the corner of my jaw. Their software should allow them to measure it after the fact though since they should have your images saved.
Regarding the do-it-yourself 2D to 3D conversion, it just took me some time fiddling with all of the options and adjustable sliding buttons to get a decent looking image. Both contrast and non-contrast can be converted. Since the styloid is dense bone, it shows up well without contrast. I never figured out how to measure the styloids for myself but there is supposed to be a way to do that also…although Jules and others say it’s not accurate anyway, even if done by a professional.
Hi Isaiah,
Your encouraging words helped make it a great day! It’s good to know that some of the post op surgery symptoms could be reduced and/or go away with time. If I can eliminate some of my symptoms I think surgery would be worth it!
Also, I’m so happy that I met a fellow ES person today! It was at my daughters routine dental appointment. I mentioned to the Dr. about my elongated styloids and asked if she can screen my daughters for that in the future and then the dental hygienist piped up and said “Hey, I have that too!” She said she gets severe head pressure just like I do! 
She found out during dental school at 29 years old during an in class assignment to exam your own panoramic X-rays and the professor pointed it out to her. She said it’s not causing a big problem for her now as her head pain is in remission. She’s 33 and said she’ll keep an eye on it when it starts causing problems again. Also, the Dr. who looked fresh out of college said she studied this in medical school, knows all about it, and said “Yep, those are some long styloids” I showed her a pic of my panoramic x-rays.
It really helped personify this condition and made me feel like I’m not some weird alien 
talking to Martian’s!! LOL 
How about that! A little “God wink” as I like to call it. Put those fears behind you and keep truckin’ along!!!
I love the expression: “Anticipation is often worse than realization”. The drive to Atlanta about did me in! I wanted to be there instantly!!! Once I got in that pre-op area I actually enjoyed the banter with the techs and nurses. Which side are you having done first?
Hi Redbird,
Wow, your day is getting close! I bet it’s such a mix set of emotions. I will definitely be praying for you! You got this! And welcome to California!
Wish you we’re coming here on better terms but hopefully you’ll be back on better ones soaking up the sun, sand, & surf 
