My journey of suffering may finally be coming to an end

Hi all,

Those who frequent the form have likely interacted with me or have came across some of my comments helping people with their imaging over the past few months.

Months and months ago I posted my own journey to the forum and what I thought was happening to me. I have a whole constellation of vascular ES symptoms - head pressure, pressure headaches, ear fullness, sound sensitivity, eye pressure, dizziness, vertigo episodes, breathing difficulties, collapsing episodes, involuntary eye movements, lateral upper neck pain, and more.

I had discovered that my IJVs are compressed - especially on my left side between my left styloid and C1 transverse process. I also have posterior cervical collateral/compensatory veins on my left side.

I ended up sending my CT scan to Dr. David Cognetti and his front desk called me and booked me a surgery consult with him for January. So I never received any official diagnosis, but I knew if one of the top ES surgeons in the US is booking me in for surgery consult, than there must be something going on with my styloids.

This could explain the intracranial hypertension symptoms, but didn’t explain my stroke-like symptoms.

We (myself and members of this forum) then discovered that my left greater horn is in direct contact with my left ICA and entrapping my left ECA. This area of the left ICA is particularly important because it is important in regulating heart rate and blood pressure. Sometime doctors will place their fingers on a patients neck in this area to test their vasovagal response (to see how it alters blood pressure). So it’s likely that the greater horn is causing my blood pressure to rapidly drop with certain head movements and swallowing. In thinner individuals, the vasovagal response is particularly exaggerated, so for someone like me who is a 5’11” male but only 160lbs (135lbs now due to being bedridden and muscle loss) a bone coming in and out of contact even lightly with the carotid sinus area is enough to cause me to buckle. This and in addition to my left vagus nerve likely being compressed, my heart rate and blood pressure has been all over the place.

Literature-wise, this seems even more rare than ES. ES is already next to impossible to get diagnosed in Canada, little alone this random freak anatomical nightmare of the greater horn.

A few months ago I went to an ENT and he shut me down pretty quick about ES and hyoid bone syndrome saying that it is very rare and that radiologists haven’t noted it as a problem. I was discouraged, but decided to come back to him with all the research on ES and hyoid bone syndrome. All the case studies and radiology research. If Western based medicine is operating upon evidence-based research, I was going to bring all the research.

I stumbled into his office a few months later. Fortunately (and unfortunately) my dizziness was out of control that day and he found me in his office’s washroom with my head in the toilet. He saw first hand how debilitated I was. I crawled my way to his office chair and started spilling the research. I could tell his demeanor about ES and the hyoid bone being a culprit. He decided to refer me to another ENT surgeon he knows who is familiar with ES and has skull-based expertise.

I met with that ENT yesterday. And oh my god, this storm if misery and suffering may be coming to an end. He sat down with me and went through my full imaging. He saw my left greater horn pressing against my ICA. He saw the left IJV compression by the styloid and the posterior collateral veins. I stared complaining that my radiology report stated that my styloids are 3.3cm but the radiologist followed it up by saying they aren’t elongated. I started talking about the definition of ES and he said that don’t worry and that I don’t need to convince him about that. In other words, he knows 3.3cm can be problematic.

He is booking me for surgery asap for both the left greater horn and left styloid. He said that this is just the low hanging fruit and if I don’t see resolution of my symptoms there is always the right side. Transparently, he said he can’t guarantee how much surgery will help. He said my constellation of symptoms are a bit more complex than most ES patients so he didn’t want to lie about suspected results.

I made sure to ask the important questions. He does transcervical approach. Given his skull-base expertise he has lots of experience with styloidectomies and tumor removals at the skull-base that required styloidectomy. I told him that I don’t care about cosmetic results and he happily and jokingly replied “but I do” - so I can be fairly confident that he’s going to make the scar as least noticeable as possible so that’s great. He cuts above the level of C1. He has done 50-60 styloidectomies and reported that he has had no issues. I don’t have any reason to suspect that he will botch me. I also get to save tens of thousands of USD (the conversion of Canadian to USD is terrible btw) compared to going with Cognetti. Cognetti is a spectacular surgeon by the sounds of things, but 50-60 styloidectomies without any poor outcomes is a large enough sample size for me that I feel safe with the decision.

He’s removing the greater horn (didn’t actually get into how much of it he’ll be removing but frankly I’m not concerned about that - as long as it doesn’t touch my carotid sinus I’ll be good) and styloid through the same incision. I don’t have an appointment date yet, but I suspect it will be soon (whatever that means in Canada lol) and will update you all.

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Also, I’m not sure if this is the norm or not, but he said I will only need to be in hospital for a few hours post surgery to be monitored before heading home!

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Wow @TML I am so pleased for you, I know you have had a long, painful and frustrating journey and you will now be getting your surgery. You have helped many of us to understand our own scans and be able to have the tools to push forward to get help. I would not have come this far in my own ES journey without your help together with @Isaiah_40_31 & @Jules. It is so good that you have managed to find a surgeon in your country. I wish you all the very best. I am sure you will keep us posted with your progress.

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So happy you’re getting answers, your symptoms sound just like mine aside from the collapsing episodes I’m so sorry I can’t imagine how horrible that must be.

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Thanks @Rosie ! I really hope the one surgery is enough.

The only potential things going against me is that the surgeon won’t be doing any C1 shaving. And I don’t suspect he would remove a posterior digastric. Worries me a bit that I’ll still have problems but I’m so broken and bedridden at this point I need the greater horn dealt with and if he’s in there anyway and has a clean record with styloidectomies and he can trim the styloid to the base then I don’t see why I dont go for it. If I need revisions I need revisions. And then there’s always the right side he said he could do too. So I have hopes. Another thing that worries me is the compression between the SCMs and anterior scalenes. But I’m hoping that with my styloid(s) gone I can change my posture a bit to address those compressions naturally. Fingers crossed.

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Thank you! Yeah the collapsing and major blood pressure drops are the biggest concerns. I really hope that trimming one side of the hyoid will fix it, but if not there’s the other side he can trim too!

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You are the epitome of self advocation, @TML! You never gave up & pressed to be heard no matter how you were treated or how you were feeling (as evidenced by the scenario you provided above :nauseated_face:). Your own research & self education about scan reading has not only benefitted many of our members but now you, too.

I’m celebrating your victory & will do a happy dance once I’m done typing this reply. :joy: :woman_dancing: I will also be praying that a surgery date will be offered to you extremely soon & that this one surgery will be positively life changing for you.

Outpatient ES surgeries, even w/ IJV decompression, are common in the US so it’s not unusual that yours would also be outpatient. You’ll likely be very sore when you head home on surgery day & for the first to second weeks, but you’re young so your body may rally faster than some of us older folks’ bodies did. I can’t wait to see what this surgery does for you! :hugs:

BTW, Thx for sharing your doctor’s name, etc. I’ll add him to our Doctors List now.

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I understand your concerns @TML but like you say, you have to start somewhere. I really hope having your styloid removed and greater horn reduced will give you the relief you need to get your life back. I had a telephone appointment with our NHS UCLH headache clinic in London yesterday, it was quite an interesting discussion with the doctor who said that I would have been born with my IJV against my C1 and that my body would have dealt with that condition. The changing entity would be the styloid growth and the fact that you lose height in your disks as you age, shifting everything slightly. So with that in mind, maybe your styloid removal and greater horn reduction will give you the relief from most of your symptoms and you won’t need a C1 shave. Fingers crossed for you.

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I’m so pleased for you @TML , you’ve put in so much time to help yourself & others and great that this has paid off! I’ll pray that the one surgery is enough, but it’s certainly worth a try & to be able to have it locally (&free!) when you’re feeling so rough is a big plus… Great news, & hope you don’t have to wait too long! :folded_hands:

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Thank you @Isaiah_40_31 ! I was just emailed yesterday evening a preoperation health questionnaire. I filled it out and sent it off and got an email back saying received. So fingers crossed I’ll get a surgery date asap!

I would dance if I could lol. Maybe I’ll wait until the world isn’t spinning anymore.

Thanks for all your support along the way :slight_smile:

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@Rosie you’re right. Tough that we get screwed around by so many doctors and so many failed theories and attempts to make things better that you become skeptical when you finally get the surgery scheduled. It’s almost like you become nervous that you may have been wrong this whole time, or that surgery won’t provide relief. I’ve read people post about this a lot in the forum. But it’s all we got! And all my research says it’s my hyoid and styloids. So onwards and upwards. Thanks for your support!

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Thank you @Jules ! And for all your support along the way :slight_smile: . I sent off my preoperation health questionnaire yesterday so I’d imagine surgery is just around the corner!

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That’s good news, everything crossed! :crossed_fingers:

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Great news. So happy for you.

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Hey there. I’m glad you are getting some answers. A friend of mine recently had a consult with Dr. Nakaji in Arizona. He is a neurosurgeon. He will not do surgery unless a Dynamic Manometry flow venogram CT is done. I guess they use a catheter to go into the vein to check pressures and such. He said a CTV scan can show what looks like compression but doesn’t show if there is actuallly blockage. He does this test to see if blood flow is actually being blocked or not. He said if its not blocked, surgery likely won’t resolve symptoms. He said because its such an invasive surgery he has his patients do this test first before proceeding to surgery. Have you done this test?

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@Ihurt I have not done this test. My surgeon just listened to my symptoms, my history of testing, all my dead ends, all my bloodwork labs /imaging. He knew nothing so far could explain my symptoms. So although he can’t be certain my styloids are causing my intracranial hypertension symptoms, he knows nothing else so far can be and nothing else can be causing the bizarre constellation of symptoms on top of the intracranial hypertension symptoms. So he doesn’t need any vascular testing or ultrasounds. He’s just going for it. He was transparent and didn’t promise me how much surgery would help, but there is no other logical path forward besides just doing it!

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That makes senses. I hope this will finally give you relief.

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This is a good explanation of why Dr. Nakaji requires the venogram w/ manometry. Thank you, @Ihurt .

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Thanks for that info @Ihurt , it’s good to know exactly what he needs…

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Congrats on things moving forward for you! I know how challenging this time has been for you. I hope this surgery gives you the relief you deserve. I also want to echo what others have said about how important you have been on this forum evaluating when members post images from scans. You’ve been a great resource for those of us looking for answers and facing some of the same hurdles you’ve experienced from docs.

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